:thumb:

what the hell is pekiti tersi kali :armyeek: is this different from eskrima kali?

It is a widely known fact in the MA world that the Filipino Martial Arts is the best when it comes to Stick fighting and Knife fighting. Even the Hollywood film "The Hunted" has given tribute to the knife fighting art of the Philipines. They may call it Kali, Escrima, Kali y daga, etc. they are still just among the hundreds of versions of the Filipino MA. The names differ based on what region it came from and which Punong-Guro taught the art. The Filipino soldiers are the ones who taught the GIs, not the other way around. It's a shame though, that Foreigners are the ones who take time and go to great lengths to learn these combat arts but the Filipinos in general, doesn't even seem a bit interested in them.

yeah its really sad.

most filipinos would rather choose a foreign martial art because to some of them everything filipino is inferior. they think its baduy and ineffective. if its ineffective, bakit ginagamit siya ng mga law enforcement and military here and abroad? in fact sobrang popular ng FMA in other countries. people would drive 6 hours just to attend a 2 hour FMA seminar. nagbabayad rin sila ng pagkalaki laki. dito sa pinas walang wala eh. mas gugustuhin pa ng mga tao Karate, Taekwondo, Kung-fu, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu at kung ano anong uso sa movies at TV.

MOST, particularly those who do not know Kali much, believe that foreign styles are better.

Some even believe that if they know Gracie Jujitsu, they will be unbeatable here. :armyroleyes:

Sus, get Gracie to do his tricks here in our streets and you'll see that an untrained street thug will not only cripple him but embroider him with fan knife stabs.

:armyLol:

Their attitude is a manifestation of their lack of understanding about martial arts.

For me?

Kung Fu or Kali?

I'd pick Kali. :thumb:

Brazilian Jujitsu or Kali?

Kali still. :armyroleyes:

Taekwondo or Kali?

I'd go for Kali. :armywink:

Karate or Kali?

Kali pa rin. :armycool:

Aikido or Kali?

Kali nga eh! :armyLol:

Kung libre?

Aba sinu na ayaw ng libre? :armycheers:

Kali is the most deadliest martial arts in the world. Even the late Bruce Lee had included our Kali Escrima in his 27 combined martial arts before he formed his own Famous style called Jeet Kune Do.

Kali is deadly in a way that it will cause internal hemorrhage and crush the bones of the opponent which really hurt. One famous Filipino Kali-Escrima instructor in U.S.A and at the same time a former student of Bruce Lee is Dan Inosanto. Peace to all.

This should be taught to our local schools. Mandatory on every grade level and promoted as the national sport.

:agree:

100 %

School life will be a lot more interesting!

Hey, pekiti tirsia kali originated where I'm from... Negros Occidental. I remember this bc my grandpa used to be such an handler with his long knives (he called it his little tricks), but, sadly, wasn't able to teach me before he died. NE ways, kali as being the deadliest... maybe.
Being one of the most brutal? Yes... oh yes, I can see that, but what happens with a kali person meets a spetsnaz operative who are trained to disarm and disable people also? Have you seen the spetsnaz martial arts? Sorry for saying this, I was just comparing the two arts the other day and saw this russian guy disable a USN SEAL armed with escrima sticks and knock him out with two hits(one elbow and the other neck). The russian guy was former spetsnaz gru.
I believe there are also other martial arts that are comparable. Republic of Korea Marine Corps have got their own martial art mujeokdo... which is similar to the Israeli Krav Maga. And these guys have also had it battle tested in Viet Nam.
There's also the fairbairn system which is mainly a knife oriented martial art of the U.K. used by the SAS and SBS. Very effective, it was developed when the British controlled Shanghai in the early 20 century... very violent times.

Here are just some, in my humble opinion, other very strong martial arts that can compaire to the kali systems of the philippines. If anyone can add more, I would love to know.

a USN Seal wielding escrima sticks doesn't mean he's a master of the Filipino Martial Arts, come on. if the Navy Seal guy used a long blade the outcome of the fight would be different don't you think? wooden sticks are used for practice. live blades are the real deal. :P

i think SYSTEMA (russian military martial art), KRAV MAGA, and other military martial arts are very good. but i think the reason why our troops didn't choose any of these martial arts is because its not applicable in our current field of battle. PTK was chosen because it uses bladed weapons and techniques suitable for CQB in the jungles of mindanao where guerilla tactics and bladed encounters happens all the time. i seriously doubt a systema, krav maga or any empty hands martial artist could survive bladed encounter while engaged in guerilla tactics.

what can you expect from a guru?

it is just that , maybe, the kali-trained SEAL guy was not in the same level as a that of the spetsnaz guru.

have the SEAL guy fight another spetsnaz-trained guy his own level and let's see what happens.

nonetheless, knowing any martial doesnt guarantee that one will win the brawl.

winning depends on the overall skill and attribute of the fighter.

one good thing though about kali is that it wont take you years before you become good at it. :armycheers:

What do you mean Spetsnaz GRU? I believe Spetsnaz (or Speznas) is separate from the GRU.

And where did you see this demonstration of a Russian operator overpowering a US Navy SEAL?

It is also probably to keep some secret techniques. In the martial arts world (as far as I know) all styles have their weaknesses no matter how good they may be. It is highly probably that the US SEAL knows a lot about eskrima but not all especially the secret moves. The SpetsNaz operator (I agree that I doubt he's also GRU which I recall is a different service) on the other hand is very confident and is more brutally trained (I recall that the new SEALs are not in the same league as the old boys - this brings into memory that stupid time out card that Clinton initiated during his time). And in the martial arts world (the real one) cheating is the name of the game. You need to do anything and everything to win and survive - which I believe the Spets was more than familiar with. They should pit master against master so we could learn what the weak points of both arts may have. A student versus a student doesn't really mean much and it might have depended more on luck.

Anyone happen to know where there's a good (and affordable) school for kali here in Manila? Interested to observe and even participate on this.

While I was attending college at north Texas, a group of martial arts practitioners wanted to learn from each other, so we formed a week long training with each other during spring break. I represented tkd, a couple of professors from boxing, we had a navy seal who knew kali (presumably ptk since there was a school 30 minutes from there), a russian guy (former spetsnaz, and his unit was under the command of the gru), a romanian guy (dunno his style), and a couple of guys representing different forms of karate.

Must be an equivalent under the GRU. Just like our SpecOps we have one for each service branch. Still, it sure must be interesting to observe that comparison test.

Haven't you guys learned from the ROTC experience? Compulsory programs breed as much ill will as support.

Make sure there are enough qualified instructors, then offer them as options in P.E.

^ I agree

ngek.

i thougth it was guru!

GRU pala!

my goodness! :armyroleyes:

Anyway, what i've posted earlier maybe the reason why the russian defeated the SEAL guy.

Baka nga guru na yung russian at yung SEAL ay starter pa lang sa Kali? :armywink:

I too!

:agree:

i remember one survival training and my arnis class (which i pathetically almost flunked hehehe), and it was mentioned that when it comes to the most handy ma available to survivalists, its knife-based and stick-based, coz u can always build (actually required if you want to survive) a knife analog or find a stick when you're down and out in the jungle..... maybe that's why we have so many knife and stick fighting styles.....

there's this ancient indian ma, used by the old indian empire, where they use super long and super flexible blades like whips.... hard to master, but used correctly can lure an attacker and decapitate him in no time....

i agree with adroth that compulsory training programs tend to put off the general youth...... if you want to make it successful, just make it glamorous :thumb:

any of you guys watched the hunted, starring tommy lee jones?
it featured philippine knife fighting techniques :specool:

Is kali and arnis de mano the same?
UE offers arnis de mano as part of PE back in '78 our instrutor was a black belt in karate as well.

I saw a fighter trained in kali and pencak silat soundly beaten by a guy trained in grappling, so I think the most practival martial arts for Marines should be those martial arts specializing in groundfighting like jiujitsu. Marines are groundfighters anyway.

Martial Arts?

Best style is Kali!

In the URCC ring maybe, but in the real world?

I dont think so. :armywink:

Ive seen a lot of URCC fights and i can tell you that if you do a Gracie when you try to fight it out with thugs or criminals in our streets or in a real fight, you'll end up dead.

Dont be fooled by the misconception that when you are good in grapling or in Gracie Jujitsu, you'll be unbeatable in the real world.

I tell you, even Gracie himself wouldnt do a Gracie if he is fighting it out in the streets of Brazil, much more if it is right here in Manila where most assailants are good at using fanblades and icepicks.

I suggest that soldiers should train more in Kali.

Important styles to consider for our soldiers?

1) Kali or Arnis or Escrima or Doce Pares (weapons and empty hand)

2) Boxing or Karate (hand techniques) Karate has kicking techniques too.

3) Judo (submission and throwing)

4) Jujitsu or Aikido (locking, submission, grappling, throwing, hand techniques)

5) Taekwondo (kicking)

These five will surely enable our soldiers to be confident enough in hand-to-hand combat.

Best three will be:

1) Kali (weapon and empty hand)

2) Karate (empty hand plus kicks)

3) Jujitsu or Aikido (locking, grappling, throwing, disarming)

What happened to swift, silent, deadly?

I think its a joke if our Marines should focus on ground fighting and grappling. In the field of combat, those things are useless. My instructor is the Chief Senior Instructor of Edged-Impact Weapons Tactical Combat of the Philippine Marines and Force Recon Marine. He told us that ground fighting and grappling are useless because the terrorists uses swords and blades in CQB not some stupid punch/kick/grappling techniques.

How would you protect yourself using your ground fighting and grappling when being confronted with bloodthirsty terrorists with swords and blades?

People are watching too much MMA/UFC/URCC nowadays. They fail to realize that inside the ring there are rules, and you fight one on one. Outside the ring, its different. You deal with multiple attackers with knives, clubs and guns. I doubt Royce Gracie would able to submit a knife fighting expert outside the ring.

Kali, Escrima, Arnis are basically the same thing. Filipino Martial Arts.

Doce Pares Escrima is a FMA style.

Pekiti-Trisia Kali, which is used by our PMC and PNPSAF, is a FMA style.


I think our Armed Forces should be taught the basics of H2H and weapons combat first since its the basis of unarmed/armed combat. They should be taught Weapons (Kali/Escrima/Arnis) and Combat Boxing first. Next should be grappling like Judo or Wrestling for takedown skills and standup grappling.

IMO, martial arts skills, like they train in Aikido/Jujitsu/BJJ, is too complicated and impractical for our armed forces. Why? Coz they take too much time to learn. They really don't need to learn those locks, submission moves, joint manupulations, throws, etc. They're pretty much useless in the battle field. No disrepect intended for the MA styles mentioned.

Kicking? For a person to be good at kicking they must have flexibility. If you want to teach our armed forces TKD, our troops will have to spend time stretching themselves to achieve those high flying kicks which are useless in real combat. So TKD is out of the option. I'd rather learn Kickboxing or Muai Thay.


My two cents.

I dont think so. A KALI Stick will already give you an edge in DISTANCE and POWER over a grappler., how come a grappler can beat a Kali practitioner ??

In the hands of a Well trained Kali practitioner, the point of entering his defense is very difficult, unless you know how to timed your move on every KALI movement that will create an opening for your advantage. Peace to all.

:agree:

and when you execute a HIGH KICK( let say in the head) the more it will affect your balance and decrease your kicking power, unless you will jump and throw kick a kick but it will telegraph your movement.

Based from your post, I think it is more practical and realistic for PMC to concentrate more on honing their skills in KALI/ARNIS and BLADED WEAPONS to adapt on actual fighting sceneraio that our MARINES are encountering in CQB. Peace to all.

You're concern on the physical factor (flexibility) and time is correct.

I believe they can do this to the PMAers nonetheless because they have enough time there.

For the first year, it should be boxing and judo. Then second year would be kicking techniques. 3rd year should be on AIkido or Jujitsu, then 4rth shall be on weapons.

For the Marine FR, SWAG, SF, SR, SAF, LRC and other units, ...

..Combat Boxing or Combat Karate plus Weapons and some Kickboxing or Muai Thai will be appropriate.

Actually, the "STICK" part of Kali is just for training purposes. The kali/arnis sticks made of rattan used by people in their training are not even fighting sticks. The real fighting sticks are the ones made of hardwood like Bahi and Kamagong.

What if the Kali practitioner uses a real sword or blade? I don't see how a grappler could survive.

Yeah, I guess the students at PMA can focus more on the complicated/advanced techniques and physically demanding techniques since they're gonna spend alot of time there.

Btw, grappling and empty hands fighting are also taught in the Marines. In Pekiti-Tirsia Kali, Dumog (or Filipino Grappling) and Pangamut (or Empty Hands fighting) are part of the curriculum. This kind of grappling/empty hands fighting are much more deadlier than other grappling/empty hands fighting arts for the use in the battlefield because it focuses more on the dirty side of grappling/empty hands fighting.

here's two articles about Dumog and Pangamut

http://texaskali.org/articles/dumog_dirty_tricks.htm

http://texaskali.org/articles/ground_combat_fighting_.htm

Guys, who wants to learn Pekiti-Tirsia Kali?

Guro Rommel Tortal, Chief Senior Instructor of the Edged-Impact Weapon Tactical Combat training of the Philippine Marines and PNP-SAF holds regular training sessions of Pekiti-Tirsia Kali in Malate, Manila. He teaches Knife Fighting, Empty Hands Fighting and Dumog (Filipino Grappling).

Class Schedule:
Wednesdays: 7pm - 9pm
Fridays: 7pm - 9pm

Location:
Om Spa, L.M Guerrero St. .Malate, Manila.

Land mark:
The street located at the back of St. Paul University Manila.

Monthly Rate: P1500

Additional Info:

Bring 2 training knives (Wooden Knives). Nabibili siya sa mga martial arts stores like Squadron Shoppe. Meron rin ata sa Quiapo. Kahit anong training clothes basta comfortable sa inyo.

wala bang discount sa PDFF members?

That suggestion might be hard to accommodate since almost all of us never saw each other in the flesh.

With your monthly rate of P1,500.00, the training knives should be free.

mahirap ata yan hehe

How about Alamid's suggestion? :armywink:

well you see mga sir, medyo mahal yung rent dun sa Om Spa kasi airconditioned yung lugar. it's also a decent place for training. actually sinabi ko kay Guro Mel yung suggestion ni Alamid pero sabi niya malabo rin raw. kung ano man reason niya, i don't know. basta ang sabi niya mura naman raw yung training knives eh. sa quiapo raw 100 each ata. you can make your own training knives nalang out of sawed off arnis sticks, mga 10 inch cut. usually, wooden training knives in martial arts stores costs 200 each, yung mga bahi and kamagon hardwood. meron rin mga tactical rubber training knives which costs P600 a piece. sobra mahal.

at saka ka o-open palang ng training last month eh pag bigyan niyo na. :armygrin: dont worr, pag uusapan pa muna namin to ng mabuti.