A friend inside SBMA told me that a Private Military Contractor (PMC) from the Netherlands is planning to set shop in Subic. He said that the representatives from the firm told him that they are willing to hire ex Filipino marines or Navy SWAG in addition to their own ex Dutch marines. The main job of this PMC from their base in Subic is anti-piracy operations in South China Sea.

Proposed start of operations will be in 2009. Juicy tidbit is daily wage is not less than US$1,000 per operator :armyeek:

More of these will make AFP just a training ground ... o well .. di natin sila masise ...

if its true that the pay is 1000 dollars per day, the Marines and the SWAG would lost many of its best personnel.

by the way switik - what is the name of this contractor from Netherlands?

Found this:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/EH14Aa01.html
The article is dated 2003, so this Dutch company is actually pushing forward with its plan.

for a mere $2500 per day for the Dutch marines?

Quite unfair to the Filipino recruits if its true that they will only be paid $1000 per day.

Someone removed the posts of me and epigone from this thread- that's saying a lot for the kind of bias there in the Mods who edited this.

:armyroleyes:

I put a lot of effort into that response to Epigone- it was really INCONSIDERATE for the Mod to remove it and yes it did pertain to that topic because it involved a govt. oversight over those Dutch PMCs.

And that mod didn't even as much inform as to the reason WHY he or she did it.

EDIT:I would like to apologize to the moderators for accusing them of a bias in the above comments, since I didn't realize that they merely moved my comments to another thread on another section that I haven't come across yet

:bow:

My comments about that nut, Epigone, still stand however..

:headbang:

I'm sorry friend but my friend did not tell me the name of the Dutch private contractor. Its just that reps from the company came to Subic last month to inspect the place.

wows taas sweldo! Too good to be true! <aybe they meant $1,000 every combat mission?

Should the philippine government intervene about this issue? Any government laws to band this type of business in our country? I mean its good for our future ex-marines, but a law might prohibited them to do such thing.

yeah, its probably on per mission basis - but its still high compared to AFP pay.

If an employee goes on only 4 missions per month he still gets paid 4,000 US or 164,000 pesos.

btw, what country hired this private security firm? and why not a local security company?

this is also being discussed in another forum, from what I gather its several shipping companies that are going to pay for this private security contractor, it seems they are not satisfied with the anti-piracy efforts of the ASEAN navies.

As far as I can remember, the Royal Dutch Marines is an elite unit.

Their feat in the succesful simultaneous rescue operations involving a hostage rescue inside a train and a schoolbuilding has been incorporated in the Special Operations manual worldwide.

No wonder they prefer SWAGS and Marines only.

are they that good?

I think our marines our more battle-hardened than their marines.

they should give equal pay to marines and swag that would join this anti-piracy outfit.

Its just another form of racial discrimination if the pay for Filipino employees are much lower than the Dutch employees.

The documentaries we see here in Germany about Dutch Marines aren't that positive...

The dutch marines are one of the best in the world today. They are truly battle tested and hardened in the fight against the Al-Queda terrorrists in afghanistan.

They own the outfit so they pay their own guys better. Besides, no self-respecting Dutch marine will join if he will be paid much lower than his government pay.

Back in 2000 or 2001, Soldier Of Fortune had a 3 part stories on piracy. They mentioned about a European security company that will have a base in Subic Bay, it wil have around 100-500 security contractors. The personnels are former Dutch and British Marines.

I remember posting this somewhere regarding mercenaries or anti-piracy

Why can't the AFP hire some contractors who will develop our own weapons, aircrafts, warships, and other military equipments?

Let's take for example the Steelcraft who built and developed the MX-8 AEV concepts.

Hiring some defense contractors will surely help our country to become more self-reliant in the long run. Because we cannot just rely from other countries to fulfill our dreams as they are cannot be our permanent supplier of our military toys, its just can't be.

The Steelcraft can probably develop more armored vehicles for us while, Danao can provide us with firearms and probably some other military gudgets or body armors with the help and support from our government to finance such joint-venture projects. Also Ferfrans can always develop some weapon system for our armors as they always do, and maybe Aboitiz Shipping can build some warships for us. While looking for some foreign or local expertise to develop our own military aircrafts are always defficult to do and the most expensive, but its possible.

Developing and acquiring our own rocket and missile technologies should be conducted as well. IT is important for us and necessary.

Maybe hiring some russian, british, and french experts can help us.

Well all good one problem though Corruption(Kick backs,funds gone like air etc) bad reputation of Government to Private Corps and of Course Militant gruops(they have a always see the military establisment as the dog of the so called Capitalist Offcials u know Communist their in thier Ranks ture na man but not all kasi sila lahat and ignorance rin so nice in all pero we need to improve things first before doing them sayang waste of time i know pero for this to go far we need to clean up both the government and the opposition we have to make them both understand that we have other treats then the Musilms Separatist and the NPA NDF and internations too but also in other nations even our own allies are treats too so why wait and die when u can fight and die well its better then noting.

There's a big different between what 'ought' to be and what 'is'. While we ought to nurture our local defense industries, the reality is that priorities are elsewhere as of the moment. Everyone's on a hair trigger, just one tiny allegation by some guy who should know better *cough*de Venecia*cough* and everyone's crying corruption.

The next question that obviously arises is funding. Where's the money for such a venture? I think the SRDP is aiming for what ought to be, but it will take some time for it to come into full swing.

The final question would be logistics. Can we support an expansion of our military's capabilities? It may seem easy since all the resources are right here, but the logistics line could go around in circles till kingdom come since this will be a new experience.

You know what they say, 'rookies talk about tactics, experts talk about logistics'.

Very true. :armywink:

FERFRANS and Steecraft is doin the great job so far. :thumb:

Another problem is that foreign defense companies are shy about doing business with the Philippines because of past dealings with the Philippine Military. For example, a case was filed by Shiboleth & Roberts in New York City, on behalf of an Israeli firm for the supply of reactive armour to the Philippine Marines for their armored assets in the early 90s. The new Filipino Marine Commandant, who replaced the one that ordered the reactive armor, did not want to purchase them because he wanted to redirect funds elsewhere. Tadiran and IAI has not ventured to the Philippines since the last century. Lockheed-Martin at one time was working on getting the Philippines some F-16s at a very discounted price, until they were evicted from Clark for not paying rent and operating a maintenance depot there. Both Ingalls and Newport News were working on a cost friendly Filipino Navy missile Corvette that was being highly endorsed and needed by Filipino Naval leaders in the late 90s, but was shot down by Orly Mercado because it was not in his plans. Due to the short sightedness of the Defense Secretaries and people above him, it would be a headache for foreign military contractors to venture back into the Philippines.
It is a dangerous precedence when a government only has weapons to the subjugate its internal objectors (COIN), and ignore it's external defenses. Even Latin American countries have weapons systems that can do both "swing roles" at the same cost and political headaches. Remember, when conventionally armed, one is also deter your neighbor from supporting internal violent objectors.
:aberet:

There is no doubt that doing business with the philippine govt including the AFP is tough specially in the past and , dependent on who is in power , etc but I think, this has not really stopped foreign or local companies from doing business in the philippines. its the job of this companies' salesmen to be patient persevering and take risks.

for example:

HF manpack radios - Harris USA
SF260 aircraft - Italy
repower of marines armor - Textron and Cummins Diesel
SAW - korea and Belgium
repower and armament of peacocks - qinetiq britain, keppel singapore and now FF Cruz philippines
army light transport - korea
UH-iH choppers -singapore
etc etc

when the AFP budget is increased some more, therewill be more projects and there will be more bidders. the greed of companies overcomes everything including politics and corruption. :lollol:

the foreign defense suppliers always appoint a philippine agent to transact their business here and grease anyone who needs to be greased

Di tatagal ang mga Filipino defence contractor dahil sa corruption sa gobyerno...
Di tulad sa US binbigyan ng priority ang defence development para sa mga defence contractor tulad ng Lockheed Martin, Boieng, Grumann etc...

on the contrary, malaki kita ng mga contractor sa defense.

kaya nga walang kwenta o kung maganda naman, sobrang mahal ng mga gamit ng sundalo natin.

Kung di pakiki-alaman ng mga opisyal ng gobyerno malaki ang kita..
Dati rin akong contractor sa gobyerno, sa mga opisyal din napoponta ang malaking kita kaya umalis na lang ako.

Pag-mataas ang presyo ng gamit militar ibig sabihin, malaki presyo ng raw materials pag-gawa. Siguro maging resourcefull na lang ang AFP tungkul dito

Kaya pala ang bagal ng SRDP natin e, tsaka mga programa nila di masyado nakakaakit, wala pa yatang plano na gumawa o magdesign ng sarili nating warships. All we need to import for now are the weapon systems w/ the procurement of electronic warfare traning.

Di talaga akong maniwalang walang pera ang gobyerno e, di lang nila kasi masyadong sinusuportahan ang importansya ng improvement of our defense capabilities natin. TSAKA SIGURADO AKONG MAY NAGBULSA LANG TALAGA SA MGA PERANG YUN! Siguro narin dahil sa mga communist-sympatizer government officials ang may kasalanan nito, naiimpluwensyahan nila ang decision making ng gobyerno natin pagdating sa modernization ng AFP at sa programang SRDP.

BTW, ang alam ko kasama sa original modernization plan ni Orly yung procurement ng missile corvettes nun, dapat nga by atleast 2003 meron na dapat tayo nun. Pero sinise nila ang lahat sa asian flu w/c was not really true kasi meron na silang naitabing budget nun na atleast $16 billion, pero biglang nawala!

Correct me if im wrong nga pls... :armyneutral:

No company in the philippines can survive if its only client and primary business is to develop equipment for the AFP. a good example is marsteel corp., they installated new and special equipment to produce large bore shells. Their steel mill business was running smoothly until they ventured into this industry. they've closed down a long time ago.

Anu pa nga ba?

Pati nga yang Abu Sayyaf kasama sa pinagkakakitaan ng mga bulok na heneral kaya di matapos-tapos yan.

Kung may pressure lang sa US at media ay ginagamit na papogi points naman ng nasa mataas na posisyun sa gobyerno.

Malakas sana ang tropa natin kasi WE HAVE THE BEST SOLDIERS.

Problema kinokontrol capability nila kaya sa labanan madami nakakatay, WHICH TELLS US THAT OUR SOLDIERS HAVE NO ADVANTAGE AT ALL BECAUSE THE ADVANTAGES THEY HAVE (PMA-Fort Bragg TRAINING, RADIOS, FOOD, REINFORCEMENT) are all negated by the advantages the rebels enjoy.

Kungbaga, the soldiers are palying teh game in the same level with the rebels. This is stupid.

Yung namamatay nag sundalo at dumaraming civilian casualites plus the economic choke is a great loss or burden to our nation.

Ayaw kasi bigyan ng tamang gamit ang sundalo kaya madami pa din nakakatay na sundalo.

Panu nga kasi lahat ng pagkakakitaan sa AFP ay pinapatos ng mga kurakot na heneral at mga pulitiko.

Pati organizational structure, imbes na lean and mean force para makatipid at maging EFFICIENT ay nakapasama. Tsk tsk tsk. Nagsasayang ng operational funds.

Sabi ng isang Lt (bagito from PMA) madalas pinapaoperate sila kesyo daw may NPA as per intel pero wala naman pala. Yung Lt na yun, 2 years na pero wala pa enkwentro at wala pa din nahuhuli. Latest ay sinibka yung batcom kasi may mga nasilip na anumalya pala.

SA HULI, KAYA NALUGLUGMOK TAYO SA GULO AY DAHIL YUNG PERA NG AFP AY NILALAGAY LANG SA KUNG SAAN PWEDE MANAKAW NG MGA HENERAL AT PULITIKO.

flipzi, matindi talaga ang kurapsyon sa bansa natin ngayon... Nakakasira ng pride natin, na instead proud tayong lahat na alam nating matindi ang AFP natin pero hinde e....

Eto huh, lahat dito alam natin na by 2011, dapat meron na tayong mga modernong jet fighters, and hopefully mga missile corvettes narin. For now, lease some of these warships w/ missile capabilities, para mas madali, while we are working on locally built warships.

Even though I am very disappointed with the fact that the marine died, when he could have been saved by stationing a helicopter in the AOR, it's amazing how some "leaders" slip. So how come a US contractor helicopter was able to get there, while the PhilAF could not? So are PhilAF helicopter pilots not trained in IMC conditions? I am familiar with Evergreen out of Washington state, USA. A lot of US prior-mil work for them. Please read below.

abs-cbnnews.com


OTHER TOP STORIES, 8/14/2008 6:04 PM August 14, 2008
AFP officials: We tried everything to save Marine Cpl. Abeto

Military officials on Thursday said they did everything to save the life of Marine Corporal Angelo Abeto, who died after being wounded in an encounter with rebels in Basilan last Monday.

Abeto's remains were brought to Manila on Thursday from Zamboanga City, where he died after sustaining wounds on the head and back. He was hit by a mortar shell in an encounter with Moro Islamic Liberation Front (MILF) members in Tipo-Tipo, Basilan on Monday.

His remains are now at the Philippine Marine Corps mortuary chapel in Fort Bonifacio, Makati.

Phil. Navy Flag Officer in Command Adm. Ferdinand Golez and Marine Commandant Maj. Gen. Benjamin Dolorfino presented to Abeto's widow Daisy the Wounded Personnel Medal and the Military Merit Medal interim in recognition of the heroism of the late corporal.

"Walang gustong mangyari ito kaya kahit paano ay binibigay namin lahat ng suporta sa pamilya para naman sila makaadjust," Golez said.

Dolorfino was short of saying that the Marines should not be blamed for Abeto's death.

"Commendable pa nga si [1st Marine Brigade commanding officer Col. Rustico] Guererro na humiram ng chopper sa US para maevacuate agad yung mga wounded Marines," said Dolorfino in response to allegations that the Marines' inability to expedite medical evacuation contributed largely to Abeto's death.

Allaga: we did everything to save Abeto

AFP Western Midnanao Commanding Gen. Lt. Gen. Nelson Allaga also paid his tribute to Abeto.

Minutes after arriving from Zamboanga for a mission here in Manila, Allaga took offense at GMA Network correspondent Jiggy Manicad's account of the incident, which was published at the Philippine Daily Inquirer last Tuesday.

In Manicad's account, he mentioned about the Marines' inability to transport Abeto to a medical facility immediately.

"Ginawa naman namin lahat ng magagawa namin. It takes time kasi. Nasa gitna ka ng encounter, may sugatan ka, hahanap ka ng landing zone, isesecure mo yon tapos nag-bad weather pa," Allaga said.

"Remember there are only ten Marines there at that encounter. Apat ang sugatan, bad weather pa. Hindi naman ganon kadali ang mag-labas ng sugatan sa gitna ng bakbakan," Allaga added.

Private helicopter used in rescue

Allaga echoed the statement made by Brig. Gen. Jorge Segovia, acting AFP command center chief and military spokesman for the North Cotabato conflict in a press conference in Camp Crame Wednesday.

"It is not true that there was no Air Force chopper that arrived. The chopper was available but the weather condition did not allow the chopper to evacuate the wounded," Segovia said.

Segovia made the clarification as he denied that lack of military logistics contributed to the cause of Cpl. Angelo Abeto's death.

The military spokesman also denied reports that Abeto bled to death. He said the Marine was hit by shrapnel from mortar fire in the head and back and his wounds were fatal.

Manicad was quoted in the PDI report as saying Abeto might have bled to death.

The television reporter also said he saw a Sikorsky helicopter of the US military evacuating Abeto and three other wounded soldiers from the battlefield.

The Marine died on the way to hospital. His body was brought to Camp Navarro Hospital in Zamboanga City.

Segovia clarified that the chopper that fetched Abeto and the other wounded soldiers was a Bell 412 owned by a private contractor called Evergreen.

"It was not a Sikorsky chopper. It [was] a Bell 412... The civilian chopper responded to the situation. It came at a time when the weather allowed it to enter the location," the military official said.

He said Evergreen is a private contractor that helps in the military's Kapit-Bisig operations on counter-terrorism. He said the civilian chopper does not engage in combat operations.

Abeto belonged to the Marine Battalion Landing Team 10 that was attacked by at least 300 members of the MILF in Tipo-Tipo on Monday.

The rebels retreated after at least eight hours of fierce firefights. The fighting started 9 a.m. and ended 5 p.m.

The military claimed to have killed at least four MILF rebels and wounded at least a dozen others during the firefight. With a report from Jorge Cariño, ABS-CBN News, and ABS-CBN Zamboanga

thats why the local defense industry is a pipe dream. not one company that i know of ever made it in maintenance alone. most have already closed shop.(maybe thats the reason why the americans brought along their own maintenace contrator)

the only aerospace maintainance firm that is still thriving here is in the commercial sector, lufthansa technik(the only profitable part of PAL so naturally the owners sold it off to the Germans).

i think our local hueys already have flight limitations due to aging.

btw it's PAF. we own those initials long before the other AF started using the same.
and im not going to give way to them.

Air Froce badly needs a chopper that can fly in all weather condition day and night. Philippine climate sometimes is unpredictable.

THE BLACKWATER CONTROVERSY

Blackwater training mercenaries in Subic

By Alcuin Papa
Philippine Daily Inquirer
First Posted 01:56:00 08/30/2009

http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/inquirerheadl...naries-in-Subic

MANILA, Philippines—An investigative report circulating online said the American military contractor Blackwater was training “mercenaries” of various nationalities, including Filipinos, at the Subic free port in Olongapo City.

Subic Bay Metropolitan Authority (SBMA) Administrator Armand Arreza, however, quickly denied the story.

In a video story posted August 28 on the Russia Today website, American investigative journalist Wayne Madsen claimed Satelles Solutions, a Blackwater subsidiary, was using a five-acre facility in the former United States naval base to train operatives for secret US-backed military operations in Iraq, Afghanistan and other hot spots.

.............................................................................................

“Incestuous” relationships between Blackwater and U.S. government

14 August, 2009, 22:06

Obama did extend the contract for Blackwater in Iraq because the infamous contractor and the government are closely tied, believes investigative journalist Wayne Madsen.







“So we have a lot of very “incestuous” relationships here between the government and Blackwater and key individuals who were responsible for contracts, and some still are,” he told RT.

What is outrageous, Madsen said, is that Eric Prince, the head of Blackwater, is supposed to act on behalf of the U.S. government, yet behaved as a self-proclaimed crusader against Islam.







“What we have here is an individual who received billions of dollars in US contracts, and still was under contract with the U.S. government, and fancied himself someone who wanted to wipe out Islam and kill Arabs and Muslims,” Madsen said.



http://www.russiatoday.ru/Top_News/2009-08...ter-wayne.html#

























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