All officers from the ROTC....

You indeed have a good point there!

Not all PMAers are better than anybody else who haven't gotten any training from the PMA.

It's sort of,....... when you can do the job better, they you must hold that post, even if you're not from PMA.

GIVING THE RIGHT POST TO THE RIGHT PERSON AND ...

... PATCHING UP THE LOOPHOLES IN THE SYSTEM THAT BREEDS CORRUPTION SHOULD BOTH BE CONSIDERED.



This post has been edited by flipzi on Nov 26 2004, 04:10 PM

As long as one is qualified to hold that post then he must not be denied to take that responsibility.


To broaden that one further, when we talk of taking any posts, it aint about getting a privilege to enrich oneself or abuse others or take advantage of others, who do not have the same authority or privilege as yours, ...

... but to take that responsibility of SERVING THE PEOPLE AND NOT YOUR SELFISH GOALS.

This post has been edited by flipzi on Nov 26 2004, 04:12 PM

not soon enough...

Hi:

Regarding UP ROTC officers making it to star rank: General Romeo Espino--AFP Chief of Staff was a UPLB advanced ROTC graduate.

I believe the real issue here is, How many UP ROTC advanced course graduates today go after college into the AFP officers corps?

Today, a few. This was unlike during the Commonwealth and early post-war years.

I believe that a military career does not appeal much today to UP ROTC graduates and advanced ROTC graduates from other top schools in the Philippines.

This is the problem--and a very serious one at that.

The pay, admittedly is lower than what one can earn incivilian careers . But a lot of UP graduates go into media--even if only for a short period in their lives. Everybody knows that the pay there is not really that fantastic, unless one is a superstar.

This is likely not the reason or at least not the primary one.


Solutions will have to be found to this.

not a bad idea, like some kind of equal opportunity clause and besides appointing more non-ayers would give a not-so-subtle signal to the pompous ayers that they are no longer top peacocks

Sounds like another "my dick is bigger than yours" discussion.

Stop this nonsense. There are assholes of Peemayers as there are much more assholes of ROTC graduates, only because there are infinitely more ROTC graduates.

It's not the school, kiddo. It's the person.

"Win or lose, it's the school I choose." Give me a break.

This post has been edited by Pendejo on Aug 29 2005, 12:59 AM

There were other UP officers that made it to star rank. Check out: http://www.adroth.ph/Philunits/unitnews/up/prominent.htm

Do you have any details about BGen. Benjamin Vallejo?

This post has been edited by adroth on Jan 21 2005, 06:14 AM

Hi:

All I know about the late General Vallejo are the following:


1) He is a UP Diliman graduate, but I do not know what course.

2) He is an advanced ROTC graduate and therefore a UP Vanguard.

3) He is a Korean War veteran.

4) He was popular with the UP ROTC officers corps when he was the commandant.

5) He obviously had superior political skills. This is shown by the fact that he was both an aide of Defense Secretary Macario Peralta--a very trusted man of GMA's father when he was president. Nevertheless, his career also thrived during Marcos' time.

Maybe, this was because both Peralta and Marcos were Vanguards. Besides, during the post-war years, ROTC and PMA graduates were evenly matched in their rivalry for top positions in the AFP.

Nevertheless, he did have his share of intrigues against him. Primary was the fact that as UPROTC commandant, not one Vanguard from Diliman or UP Manila joined the AFP officers corps.

Adroth, I suppose you know these already.

Cheers, anyway.

What was Gen Vallejo's course?

In my freshman batch at UP Diliman, 8 of us went to PMA. Six of us ended up in the armed forces. Contrast that to not a single UP ROTC graduate from the same batch who chose to serve in the armed forces. I know for a fact that not a single DLSU or ADMU graduate from my peer batch joined the armed forces too. Not even one from those schools entered the PAF Flying School during my time.

I guess if you are a university graduate you have more career options open to you. If you are are at the top of the heap with an engineering, economics or business degree from UP, La Salle or Ateneo why would you go to the army?

In fact, very few ROTC graduates from the Ateneo, La Salle or UP seek a commission and service in the armed forces. There are very few cum laudes who graduated from ROTC who joined the armed forces. Pray tell me why this is so.

Take my word for it, how many ROTC graduates in active service ever graduated from AIM or foreign graduate schools other than military career courses. It's either the die hards or those with little chance of making it in the civilian world who join the military and people wonder why few ROTC products rise in the AFP hiearachy.

Our ROTC program should be overhauled so that honest to goodness ROTC scholarships are offered to the cream of the crop. Give our young men and women an incentive to serve at least 8 years in the armed forces. For the cost of sending one Filipino to PMA, we can send several students to top universities.



This post has been edited by Pendejo on Jan 24 2005, 01:30 PM

You present a most intriguing idea.

What sorts of incentives did you have in mind?

What do you believe are the flaws in the current ROTC scholarship program?

This post has been edited by adroth on Jan 24 2005, 02:15 PM

What sorts of incentives did you have in mind?

How would a 17 year old with intellectual potential but little financial capacity consider a 4 year full scholarship at top tier universities? Obvious diba? There will be many takers.

It costs the government something like P2.5 Million to P3.0 Million to produce a PMA graduate. With the same kind of money the AFP can send 3-4 full scholars to a Level 4 University (DLSU and ADMU). Choosing other universities with excellent reputations in the Visayas and Mindanao would not be as expensive. I am not favoring La Salle, UP or Ateneo. There are other universities with excellent reputations. To name a few, Siliman University, Xavier, there is a wide list.

In principle, the ROTC scholar will have to qualify under very competitive terms to enter the program. He incurs a contractual obligation equivalent to 2 years for every year of scholarship. After graduation he is obligated for 8 years, just like Academy graduates. If he drops out of the program he is obligated to render enlisted service under the same terms. After he earns a Bachelors degree the candidate goes through a 6-month finishing school similar to OCS. During the 4 year academic training he undergoes 8 semesters of military science and leadership courses. There will be 4 summer terms (4 weeks duration just like PMA) with intensive military training where all cadets from different universities participate.

Funding? The funding is already there, instead of spending it on training thousands of reservists who will hardly ever be used we might as well spend most of that money on a few but quality products.

What advantage does this have? The armed forces obtains infinitely high quality officer material backed with a solid academic foundation reared in a social environment that bridges the military and the civilian sector.

Mind you, we are talking now of high quality ROTC products who will embark on a military career, at least for 8 years.

It can be modified for 2-year scholarships, or half scholarships.


What do you believe are the flaws in the current ROTC scholarship program?

Biggest flaws.

- Emphasis on quantity, less on quality.

- Training is more on form than on substance. The Rainbow concept was an example of substance rather than form.

- The current ROTC training has to answer underlying questions: What kind of graduates do we want to produce out of basic and advanced ROTC? Does the typical basic ROTC graduate meet the standard? How about the advanced ROTC graduate?

I am thinking out loud with these ideas. They can be modified, improved and fine tuned. The principle is to attract highly qualified people, offer them high quality education, a guaranteed job and career in exchange for a contractual obligation with the armed forces.

This is what we want to produce

- Officers who possess breadth of integrated, fundamental knowledge in the basic sciences, engineering, the humanities, and social sciences, and depth of knowledge in an area of concentration of their choice
- Officers who are intellectually curious
- Officers who can communicate effectively
- Officers who can frame and resolve ill-defined problems
- Officers who can work effectively with others
- Officers who are independent learners
- Officers who can apply their knowledge and skills to the unique tasks of the military profession
- Officers with a high sense of duty, honor and country
- Officers who will be citizen soldiers, committed to a lifetime of service to country and people whether in the military, government or the private sector.

Can ROTC today produce officers of this calibre?

This post has been edited by Pendejo on Jan 24 2005, 07:37 PM

This is indeed an idea worth exploring. Let me get back to you on this.

However, I must take exception to the following:

The question was not about the all-too-apparent flaws of the ROTC program, I was focusing on the problems of existing scholarship programs. Your mentioning the Basic ROTC program indicates that you missed that point.

I was referring to Article VII, Section 43 of RA 7077, which states:

There are no ROTC scholarships for Basic ROTC cadets.

I understand, however, that the scholarship you are proposing is a much more radical program that will drastically change the way Philippine ROTC is currently run, and will allow it to keep cadence with its American cousin.

Such a change will have benefits not only for the AFP, but the local schools as well. More later.

This post has been edited by adroth on Jan 25 2005, 12:12 AM

I do not want to beat a dead horse as this topic has long been a subject for debate. You are more familiar with the ins and outs of the ROTC system as can be read in your websites. I'm not familiar how the scholarship incentives for ROTC are implemented but I am convinced that the current system does not attract high calibre candidates for service in the regular force or active duty components. That is a given.

The biggest difference in copying the "American cousin" form is that the incentives create an ROTC program geared to producing quality serving officers for the regular force rather than just reservists.

Then we can put a stop to all these ROTC vs Service Academy whining and see some ROTC punk make a fool of himself for a change.

This post has been edited by Pendejo on Feb 26 2005, 01:06 PM

High calibre candidates are indeed very few and very far in between

This post has been edited by adroth on Jan 25 2005, 02:12 AM

We can start with state colleges and universities but the problem here though is that leftist movements have high penetration rate on these institutions (though UP is fast declining). This can be an avenue for security breaches and penetration a mechanism should also be installed to prevent this.

State Colleges and Universities usually have scholarship offices that acts as clearing house for scholarship donors and recipients, it can be used to facilitate ROTC scholarships.